An old Glorn Suggestion...

Level 15 abilities! (Level 5 ults)

I want to keep the level cap the same though!

That is, you can have a level 40 build, that is 15-15-5-5.

It is intentional that you will not be able to max ALL of your skills. However, for a price, players can buy more skill points! Sayyy, 10,000G, and you can buy 4 points.

To deal with balance, I will scale all spell differently, and have to re-balance every skill in the game. Nuking spells will have damage upgrades every 5 levels, for example.

This should allow for an entire new concept on all build ideas, and allow for truly unique builds, no matter what skills you happen to pick.

Anyone got any ideas or thoughts on the topic? post your complains!

sounds good. will have to make a max level you can make a skill though otherwise...
well i spose the game wont get there half of the time though...

T-UP already, though i think you will have to rebalance everything, and make teh skill point cost depend on levels, make like 4 groups lvl 1-10 11-20 each having a seperate cost for skills changing things up a bit

love it, do it

A shitload of work, but it sounds legit.

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t is intentional that you will not be able to max ALL of your skills. However, for a price, players can buy more skill points! Sayyy, 10,000G, and you can buy 4 points.

IMO 4 points at end game is worth more then 10,000g. If this is reserved for level 40's also its going to create a "Farm-Boom" meaning less in arena PvP and result in more want to play 2 hour games because their is new end game content that is worth playing.

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To deal with balance, I will scale all spell differently, and have to re-balance every skill in the game. Nuking spells will have damage upgrades every 5 levels, for example.

Re-balancing the entire game is going to through a fork into the gears for a lot of people who don't play this like we do. In the last few months the game goe's through drastic changes as soon as people get used to the prior changes. This may not go over so well with the general public having to re-learn the entire game. Creeps will also have to be rebalanced just incase you were thinking of that.

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This should allow for an entire new concept on all build ideas, and allow for truly unique builds, no matter what skills you happen to pick.

That your right about.

This is a double egded sword idea, that is it could very quickly put the game in the shitter or it could make it A LOT more interesting. Careful when you are doing this.

do it but keep the original and host this a few times a day or on a different bot to see how people react imo its a good idea but some people might disagree

.........Goin 2 chase away pubs from my uber gankings skillz.................
with complicated game modes....

oh btw make it 1 for 2000 then not 10k fro 4 -.-

I dont know a lot of the skills I simply find not worth leveling at a certain point I mean sure you have the one or two lets max this skill because its uber imba at such and such point but most of them are simply not worth a damn after a while.

Case and point any farm skill rarely surpases 7 skill points
Your farming ults are generally not even worth the 4th skill point unless your like way behind.
I hardly notice any real difference between a level 12 debuff and a level 11 atleast not enough of 1 to make me go wait I need to spend 10k for -7 more armor becuase its so uber.

Honestly I would have to see a more drawn out sketch of the plan but for the most part Id rather have the goddamn tomes or items then the extra level of 90% of the skills in the game.

That's just your own opinion, according to the prophecy. You mad? Buy four extra skill points for $$$$ Profit!

what the hell KJC you live in Edmonton? what side?!

Hop on the ban wagon all you want I just make my profit selling the over priced wagon wheels.

Epic makes the legit points here, as does didnot.

Epic Says:

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IMO 4 points at end game is worth more then 10,000g. If this is reserved for level 40's also its going to create a "Farm-Boom" meaning less in arena PvP and result in more want to play 2 hour games because their is new end game content that is worth playing.


Re-balancing the entire game is going to through a fork into the gears for a lot of people who don't play this like we do. In the last few months the game goe's through drastic changes as soon as people get used to the prior changes. This may not go over so well with the general public having to re-learn the entire game. Creeps will also have to be rebalanced just incase you were thinking of that.


This is a double egded sword idea, that is it could very quickly put the game in the shitter or it could make it A LOT more interesting. Careful when you are doing this.

first of all, to clear this up between people, it will be 10,000 per point purchased, and they can be purchased at any point during the game. You can buy up to... say... 4 points. No more than that. I dont see how a 40k difference in total game purchases can be considered "dragging a game out two hours". Keep in mind, players will have the ability to focus on spells, making them stronger; while items stay the same. The leveling rate will remain the same; and creeps will remain the same. This will allow for potential use of skills for later-game farming...

As didnot says; there isnt much of a reason to level a farmer past 7. Usually I stop anywhere between 5 and 9. If the abilities scale better, it might be worth the skill point dump. Also, maybe you will only wanna put 7 points into that ability, and focus 15 into another.

Epic's point about rebalancing the game is gonna throw forks in gears... As I have been editing for a year and a half... I have had two massive item packs added, three hero packs added, and two large spell packs added. Every time i make a massive change to the potential use of builds, the game has had a popularity boom. I have no fear at all, that enhancing the game, and forcing players to change their playstyles would make less people play. Beta20 essentially changed gameplay, as far as creeping and field pvp is concerned; but pretty much everyone I have talked to, liked the changes.

In the past few months, the only thing to change, has been the terrain; I dont see what you are saying about "derastic changes" Really, look at the past few update posts... mostly bug fixes, a few skill changes, for the sake of balance... a lot more bug fixes.. changed terrain... and... well... I havent done a lot of work, have i? ><

Anyway, I like the thought you put into this epic. anyone else wanna put some critical thinking into it?

Just another note, Revolutions Final will be out before I do this. it will take ~2 months of private testing to balance enough for the public.

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first of all, to clear this up between people, it will be 10,000 per point purchased, and they can be purchased at any point during the game. You can buy up to... say... 4 points. No more than that. I dont see how a 40k difference in total game purchases can be considered "dragging a game out two hours".

10k PER POINT, seems good. The way you had it written in the original post made it sound like a collective 4 skill buy, in other words 2,500g per skill would be imba;

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Sayyy, 10,000G, and you can buy 4 points.

i can deal with 10k though.

The dragging on issue was also a misinterpretation, I thought you had to be level 40 to access these. And I now agree, f these are buyable at any point actually they would add more diversity to builds and games. If it was a level 40 restricted option it would string out games as people would farm to 40 to boost their skills. Being able to rush extra skills mid game though would be a lot of fun for ganking, farming or pretty much anything.

The drastic changes I probably should have said several months. Between the massive change between 6.2 -> Revolutions, the balance changes (such as the puppet master one), Terrain change etc. Just from playing pubs you oversee a lot of "why in the fuck was this changed this is gay." As I said its a double edged sword, people will love it or hate it, so far they have loved it all.. I just meant make sure you take your time and do it right the first time.

And by the way, loved the nickname from last night/this morning... Optimoose Prime haha... And fuck Geddy Lee, and fuck Rush.

Do It!!!

Lmao epic, it was "Ooptamoose Prime" And how can you say "fuck geddy lee"?! You go to hell! You go to hell and you die! the only good thing to ever come from canada, in the history of canada existing, and you say such sacreligious things them... Hey, why dont you just go sell Alaska, which earns more money than the entirity of Canada, to America? Ohhh, wait... you did...

US: 1
CAN: 0

But yeah, pubs always hate change, because... well.... they expect to eventually find 1 build that will beat all builds. And even in minor edits, I take that 1 over-used build... And change it a tiny bit, so no one wants to use it anymore.

I think secretly, if I left it to sit for too long, pubs would get bored of using the same build; and have to quit... cuz... you know... there is only 1 build in the game...

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Hey, why dont you just go sell Alaska, which earns more money than the entirity of Canada, to America? Ohhh, wait... you did...

Lol, look at my provices (Alberta) Gross income from bitumen. Alberta > Alaska. Plus Alaska is responsible for Sarah Palin, that's an automatic loss. Plus we in the West are not responsible for the Easts short sited ways. We have been stuggling with that for decades.

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You go to hell and you die! the only good thing to ever come from canada, in the history of canada existing, and you say such sacreligious things them...

Sir, again you are wrong:

I) Maple Syrup
II) Poutine
III) Hockey
IV) Pamela Anderson
V) Lacrosse
VI) Me
VII) Santa Clause

I can keep going if you want... the list just keeps getting better..

i hate to be a party pooper, but we bought alaska from the russians not the canadians.

I would remove Pam Anderson from the list she may have been born in canada but everything else was made in the usa. Meh who cares not like it matters much like the canadien military power all this stuff doesnt matter.

@ Charge. Touche, can't believe I forgot about that.

@ Sharky. Whats dumber, spending trillions on military power to fight wars that are theoretically impossible to win under the Geneva Convention or redirecting that capital into things like universal health care. By the way, thats another point for Canada, free mother fucking healthcare bitches.

Oh ya Sharky

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only good thing to ever come from canada

Being born somewhere generally infers that they're "from" there. learn2read nub.

lol, nationalism gives everyone a reason to back up their geographical region.



well at least your looking for somewhat a\objective pros and cons instead of over generalized simplified versions of right and wrong

Dude Im fucking around I could care the hell less by the way good trolling dude props.

This is for my reference, in the scaling of some basic abilities, to make them easier to balance...

Nukes Right now:

Chain Light:
Mana Cost - 100+30xLevel
Damage for levels 1-7 (Primary) - 70+70xLevel
Damage for level 8+ - +90xLevel
Damage Gain (% per target) - 5
Maximum Targets - 3+1 every 2 levels

Frost Fall:
Mana Cost - 85+25xLevel
Damage level 1-7 - 50+70xLevel
damage level 8+ - +90xLevel

Frost Nova:
Mana Cost - 100+50xLevel
Target Damage Level 1-7 - 30+70xLevel
Damage level 8+ - +90xLevel
Nova Damage Level 1-7- 50+50xLevel
Nova damage Level 8+ - +75xLevel
Frost Duration - 2+1xLevel (Max 6)

Poison Nova:
Mana Cost - 110+40xLevel
Damage for levels 1-7 - 5+9xLevel
Damage for level 8+ - +16xLevel

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These will be my base stats, when I scale them to be level 12... Just something for me to compare against...